Not sure

[Tigger1]

No, after I had said it people stopped.

[Heather]

Okay.

So, while it sucks that you had to set that limit, and that these people a) don't know how to behave professionally, and b) have said things to you that are not supportive, that's just how this goes sometimes, with pretty much anything.

For example, maybe two people at work were dating, then broke up. Some people would likely ask about that during work meetings, and some of them might also talk like insensitive fools about it. What this is about for you is obviously more loaded than that, but what's happening here in general is just there being jerks or idiots at your workplace just like most people tend to have jerks or idiots in their workplaces. But you did what you could do here, and it sounds like this isn't ongoing, but something that happened, but now isn't happening, or is at least on the clear path to being a thing nobody does.

Of course, that doesn't make that they did it not hurt or feel invasive as hell, nor does it mean all the bad feelings you have from that will now magic away. But I think talking about things like this as always, or getting really defeatist about them and yourself with them is you looking to hurt yourself. Because you DID stand up for yourself, rather than failing at it, for example. You're not unable to do that like you're expressing feeling, you were able. You are able. Dismissing that reality -- and thus, denying your own successes and your own self-care -- is only going to keep you stuck in feeling bad and not really see, and thus not fully experience, your own progress as well as your own increasing sense of well-being. Make sense?

[Heather]

Btw:

I know the whole thing isn't going to be magically better over night and that its gonna take a while for me to get some sort of normality back into life but I just wanted to focus on me, on something I wanted and feel part of my void with that. Is that so wrong?

This also feels, to me, like one of these kind of trick-yourself-out-of-your-own-esteem ways of thinking. You know, after all, that wanting people at work to behave like people at work should isn't wrong, and that it also isn't wrong to want any part of or place in your life to be a place where you can feel safe and like "normal." So, why ask that? Why not just know that of course those things aren't wrong, remind yourself of that, and not ask something that basically second-guesses those things you rightly know?

[Tigger1]

Yer that makes sense.
As I said I was having a few really good days, mentally and physically good days where getting out of bed and feeling good about myself came hand in hand. Something to do that I feel proud of, something to focus on and make my strengths and abilities stand out in a positive way, then morons like that attack what I am already feeling, being told your unhinged is hurtful, I'm dealing with this as best I can, in my own way and if that makes me unhinged then so bloody be it. I am not here to panda to other people. I'm here to live my life how I want to. It doesn't in any way help what little self esteem I do have left to hear hurtful comments/questions that set of flashbacks, nightmares etc

[Tigger1]

Yet there I go again! Second guessing myself!
What I mean is the self esteem I have had and built the last few days has now disappeared because of people's comments about me being unhinged. A feeling I have already been feeling due to my up and down moments. Questions about assault that hurt and set things off for me, make me return to that moment of crap, feeling all the hurt all over again
But I do have strengths, I do have abilities and my new focus will build on those.

[Heather]

But it hasn't. If it had when they said those things, you would not have been able to set the limits you did.

Instead, you took a hit, and you felt it. But while that may have momentarily impacted your esteem, it didn't make it vanish or go away. Again, if it had, you would not have had any ability or desire to set those limits. Those people din't take away your self-esteem. Don't give them that, not only because it didn't actually happen in reality, but because you're working hard to take better care of yourself, which involves giving yourself credit due for standing up for yourself.

[Tigger1]

It just hurts, that's all, because as you say I have been working so so hard to care for myself the last few days both physically and mentally. Even borrowed someone's kitchen to make food! Not being able to make good food from scratch is taking its toll so I actually stepped out of my comfort zone completely and asked to borrow someone's kitchen. We surprised ourselves with what we tried to make!
I've got my app and I've been making daily lists, I've got my app to calm me down during panic attacks. Nightmares are still an issue but daily panic attacks are becoming shorter which is a bonus and I have MY project to carry on with and assist people.
Part of me feels I can actually make a difference here and then part of me is still struggling with the daily stuff and the stuff that still remains so loaded for me. It's like this internal battle going on.
Yes I took a hit and heck it hurt a lot but I suppose what I think your trying to say to me (correct me if I'm wrong!) is not to let one muppet put back up all the hurdles I've already taken down.... I've already had one moron take so much from me and I shouldn't let that happen again.....

[Heather]

I understand.

One thing I would posit, though, is that the harder you hold onto the hurt from stuff like this, the more and the longer it hurts. You can't control what already happened, or what people do, but how much you stay focused on it once it's over -- including talking about it like it's still happening when it happened, you drew a line, and it stopped -- IS something you have control over. Same goes with focusing on what IS good, including what was good in those situations, like you setting those limits clearly and being effective at doing so.

[Tigger1]

Yer think that makes sense.

[Tigger1]

Hey,

When you said about the therapy bit (to do with my nightmares, just woken from another one) can I tell them exactly what they are about, the details I mean or do I have to give like an overview sort of thing? These are really freaking me out and I end up panicking afterwards but I'd i think about them, logically think about them, i know what they mean, I just don't know how to make them stop.

[Sam W]

Hi Tigger,

You can go into as much detail as you think they need (if they feel like they need more, my guess is they'll ask you to elaborate). You can also tell them exactly what you told us here: that you think you've know they mean x, y, and z, and that your main concern is coming up with some ways to make them stop (you probably can't get them to go away entirely, but there may be things you can do to make them less frequent). If you want, you can also ask to talk about some things you can do when you wake up from them, so that the effects of the nightmare fade pretty quickly.

[Tigger1]

Hi Sam,

That makes sense, my way of currently 'dealing' with them is to just stay awake, so that they don't come back and to try and stop panicking I use my sound app and draw. I will bring them up when I see the therapist later this week. As I said I think I know what they mean but finding a way around them so I can get a good nights sleep is a priority for me at the moment, I'm getting more anxious about things because I'm tired and my brain can not function on such little sleep which is making me much more sensitive than I perhaps would usually be. Although it's a sensitive time anyway.

[Sam W]

That sounds like a plan. I'm sorry they're putting such a strain on you. Some things you might try in the interim (in addition to the drawing, which is great) would be other soothing things before bed, and things to help focus your brain on subjects other than nightmare material. I've also heard people advise setting up your sleeping space in a way that feels most secure and comfortable for you (nightlights, comforting objects, soothing sounds, etc). One survivor I know also suggests that, if you wake up from a nightmare, try doing something to ground yourself. She always said that just sitting up and putting her feet on the floor helped bring her back and remind her that she was somewhere safe.

Something you could also look into is learning how to lucid dream. That would be more of an ongoing process, but could help find ways to exert a little more control over your dreams.

[Tigger1]

Yeah, to be honest I tend to play my music before I go to bed, helps to listen to classical music to chill so that I'm not focused on the things that bring on the nightmares etc but I suppose subconsciously I'm still focused on being alert due to safety aspects and subconsciously still focused on stuff I'm trying not to fully focus on, if that makes sense. I'm living full time in a hotel at the moment so trying to relax can be problematic anyway as hotel rooms are not exactly the nicest places to be. Although I have got a few homely things with me. Not entirely sure at the moment how long I will be staying in this hotel for but hopefully if I can grasp the whole deal with things as best I can and try and get some sleep maybe I will have a better handle on things, maybe I won't feel so low, i guess this is just part of my whole process one that's going to take time to deal with, I am pleased I have support though, from all of you guys and therapy, I don't think I could do any of this without that support system. I will just have to start opening up more to my therapists to make sure I'm getting the most out of it rather than being (as Heather put it yesterday) stuck in the bad stuff. I just find it hard to talk about when someone's face to face with me. I think letting go of my nightmares to another person is kind of about the whole feeling vulnerable again thing. Although I'm not sure I can feel any less vulnerable than I already do on most days.

[Tigger1]

Hi Mo,
Wondered if I could ask you some questions please?
Tigger

[Mo]

Sure thing!

[Tigger1]

Cool,
Not really sure how to word these though so might have to bear with me!

1) does this whole healing process come in any sort of stages!? If so how does someone push onto the next stage or is it literally just timing
2) is it ok for the whole self blame thing to come and go?

[Tigger1]

3) why do I still even now feel so dirty and feel like I can smell him,
I wasn't as you know, fully aware of what happened that night but I did spend a lot of time with him before hand and like today I was randomly sitting on a bench and thought I could sense him somehow.

[Mo]

Healing is definitely not something that happens in a straight line, where you know that as you travel forward in time you will "get better" at a steadily increasing rate. It might help to imagine a graph showing upward growth overall, but with high and low points scattered throughout. It's normal to have low points or setbacks during the healing process, even as things are improving over time. It's really common for a lot of feelings or reactions to fluctuate in terms of how often or strongly you're feeling them; having feelings of self-blame come and go is part of that. I think it's helpful to keep that in mind so it doesn't feel like a setback means things are permanently worse, or you'll never feel better.

It's hard to identify specific stages in healing, but as it progresses you may notice things that feel like achievements or "stage markers" to you. That may be a point where you stop having nightmares, feel comfortable in certain spaces, or notice you haven't felt any self-blame or dirtiness for a while or that you're not thinking about the assault as much in your daily life. (And again, if you ever hit those points and feel like those things become an issue again, it doesn't mean healing's "backtracking," just that it's not always linear.)
I wish there was a way I could tell you to get to the next steps in healing for sure, but it really is just something that takes time. Getting support and having compassion for yourself can help but it's not something you can rush - and I think worrying about the timing, and thinking "why isn't this happening FASTER??!?" can cause yourself extra stress that might make things happen more slowly.

[Mo]

In terms of why it feels like you can feel or smell him - sense memory can be very strong, and many people find that a stray scent or sound can trigger traumatic thoughts or memories pretty easily. It's a pretty understandable fear response from your body! That's something else that may fade with time, and it could be that at some point you can recognize things that might trigger that reaction and try to avoid them.

[Tigger1]

Thanks Mo,

That info helped, I'm still trying to figure out my process and how I'm dealing/coping with it all or not as the case maybe! I haven't been doing much talking in my therapy sessions as have found it difficult to actually say words. I'm in therapy again tomorrow and thought I'd give it my best shot, the only way she is going to be able to help and support, I suppose, is if she has enough information to go on, I feel like I'm ready now to give it a go and see what happens, I'm not saying I'm going to go in there and fire on all cylinders but I'm thinking that offloading some of the stuff inside my head will be a good thing. It's not going to make me feel any worse is the way I'm looking at it. Its good to know that even after having a few good days that it can be normal to have a few bad ones afterwards, or a few bad minutes.
As you say hopefully I will learn to control the things that trigger bad memories etc and hopefully talking through my nightmares will assist me in the 'feelings' behind them.
Thank you again!

[Tigger1]

Hi Redskies,

Wondered if it would be possible at some point to arrange a chat session with you please?!
Not sure when the chat session things with you are available or if your still willing to chat?
Thanks
Tigger

[Sam W]

Hi Tigger,

I left a note for Redskies, just in case you two were not able to connect yesterday. In the meantime, is there anything you need to talk about that you feel comfortable mentioning on the boards?

[Tigger1]

Hi Sam,
Thanks if leaving note
No wasn't able to connect with Redskies yesterday but was fairly late in the day, due to time differences etc.

If it's ok, I'd rather just catch up with Redskies. As not comfortable talking through some of my stuff on boards ATM.
Hope that's you
Thanks Tigger.

[Tigger1]

Hi,

Therapy sucked! What a total waste of time.
therapist (t) me (m) the conversation went;
T; how have you been?
M; not so great, been dealing with a lot of stuff, I've also not been sleeping as I've been having these really bad nightmares.
T) aww, ok, so are you trying to stop these from happening, are you doing something relaxing before you go to bed?
M) yes, I've started listening to classical music to calm myself but it doesn't seem to be helping.
T) hmmm ok, hopefully you will start seeing improvements but it will take time.
T) changed subject.

Am no further forward than I was this morning, in fact I've actually come away from therapy feeling rather angry. im no further forward on working out how to deal with them or talking these thoughts or feelings through and feel like some sort of effort should of been made to ask if I'd like to talk about that further like the therapist did a couple times today with other stuff!! There aren't suppose to be any taboo subjects in therapy that's what my therapist said but I'm feeling like my nightmares might just be such a subject! I'm not asking her to talk through a dream book with me, I'm not asking for her to magically make them stop but IMO they mean something and the emotions i feel about them continue to be stuck inside because I didn't feel able to carry that conversation on!!

Sorry for the long rant, am feeling incredibly angry tonight, i feel like I've basically just wasted my time on silly subject matter that has IMO nothing to do with how I'm actually feeling right now or what I'm trying to deal with! Argh.