Scarleteen

I'm 19 and AFAB non-binary. I've been on T for two months as of today, but no matter how many times I try to talk about this, journal, hype myself up, etc., it just won't go away. I feel like I'm in this weird space and can't find anyone else like me in the community. Leading GSA for 3 years, volunteering at Pride, and surrounding myself with queer friends has given me so much valuable experience and community, but I still feel so alienated. My current end goal is just to be androgynous, which can raise a red flag for some people due to the idea that non-binary people have to be androgynous. I understand the community's hesitation when I say this, but it's hard when people (even some friends) are trying to tell me my lived experience and feelings are wrong. Similarly, I don't experience bottom dysphoria and want to have penetrative sex, and I'm really looking forward to that when I find the right partner for me. Despite this, I feel guilty for having a genital preference. I wouldn't turn down a masculine nonbinary person or trans man if they had what I was looking for, but I still feel like I'm being transphobic. I also wouldn't mind taking the "traditionally female" role in the relationship and honestly enjoy many aspects of the idea of it. This makes me feel conflicted because then I feel anti-feminist or like I'm going against my own beliefs. I'm very politically active in my local punk and queer scenes, so it's hard to feel that way.I feel guilty for having these preferences, and I truly believe that I'll never get to experience a happy relationship. I never see supportive men with non-binary partners, and the trope of AFAB enbys detransitioning when they date men makes my heart sink. I'm very stubborn and will never compromise myself, but I also feel I'll have to if I ever want to find someone.As if being transgender wasn't hard enough, I also have a lot of bad experiences from my childhood that I know would make me a difficult partner. I was a victim of COCSA twice, which leads to a very complicated relationship with my sexuality. I have also always had anxiety and have a very anxious attachment style. These are all things I continue to try to work on, but I know they will never go away.I don't think I'm particularly ugly or anything, but I also don't get much attention from men. I find that everyone thinks I'm a lesbian when they meet me, which is so strange because sexualities don't have a look. I have minimal experience with a, uh, situationship, which wasn't a healthy experience. I'm trying to work on making more friends this year so I can keep working on my interpersonal skills, which are definitely lacking after a few difficult years. Last but not least, I don't understand dating. I've watched all the videos, listened to my friend's experiences, and learned about the apps, but I just can't see myself being into someone who isn't a friend. I'm aware this puts me somewhere on the aromantic spectrum, but the idea just makes my stomach sink. I know dating apps aren't for me, and I try to take screen-free time as it is, but on top of everything else, this just feels like the nail in the coffin.I know I'm young and don't need to rush into anything, but I also want to have these experiences. I'd never rush into it, but I hope to be happily settled with a life partner one day and some critter kids
Sorry for the poor grammar and amount of text; this has really been weighing on me for a long time, and I hope you have some insight.

Hey there GroupieReclaim, and welcome to the boards

I’m sorry to hear you’re having concerns about how certain aspects of your identity might appear to others. It sounds like you’re aware of your orientation and are taking the steps to immerse yourself in queer community, but that you still feel isolated. The feeling that nobody else in your community is like you can be a really upsetting one to feel and manage, and I hear you that you’re worried that these aspects of your identity might impact finding a relationship. You’ve mentioned a few topics, and I have some thoughts, so I’ll section them out here and we can go from there.

Gender Identity
When you say that presenting as androgynous as a non-binary person raises a red flag, could you elaborate on that a bit? To be honest, I haven’t heard anything about someone presenting as androgynous being a red flag, but it could just be that I haven’t heard it personally. I have certainly heard the incorrect assumption that non-binary people “must” look androgynous, which we know is totally untrue, but I’m curious how that might translate to you not being able to present as androgynous, or what your concerns are if you choose to present as androgynous? I might be able to give more tailored advice if I can understand a bit better. Though, one thing I want to say initially is that I believe you can present however you’d like to, and that doesn’t have to match up with anyone’s expectations of what you “should” look like based on your identity.

“Genital preference”
So, the whole argument about genital preference is a tricky one, and I’ve personally found it to be a bit unhelpful when reflecting on how attraction actually occurs. We’re not meeting everyone naked, and most times we experience attraction to people way before we ever see their genitals. I do think it’s normal and okay to want to have certain kinds of sex with certain genitals, but I’d file this phenomenon more under “orientation” rather than a choice or a preference. I also want to say that, when it comes to sex and dating, what genitals someone has is just one small detail in a whole person, and it can be reductive to talk about sexuality as a search for folks with certain genitals. How does hearing that make you feel?

Gender roles
The idea that feminism doesn’t hold space for all expressions of love in a relationship, including expressions that some might view as taking a “traditionally female” role is not supported by most definitions of feminism. I don’t think it’s “anti-feminist” to want to take care of your partner, for example, or do household tasks, or make food for your loved one; the way I understand it, I think it’s more anti-feminist to call those things “traditionally female.” If it makes you feel badly to view the things you want to do for your partner as “traditionally female,” it might help to know that most feminists would say that the things you want to do for your partner don’t make you traditionally female, they just make you an accountable and caring partner.

I hear you, too, about your concerns about (cis?) men with AFAB enby folks, but I want to invite you to broaden your perspective on that if you’d like to. As an AFAB genderqueer person with a supportive male partner, I’ve found that my partner’s gender identity isn’t stopping him from affirming my identity as a partner — I am also not detransitioning. I’ve certainly also had experiences with crappy cis men, and it’s indeed a widespread thing, but holding onto the generalization that men in general can’t or in general don’t support nonbinary people is going to do more work to continue these negative feelings. Know what I mean?

Sexual trauma
I am so sorry to hear you experienced COCSA and that you had a bad experience in your situationship. Nobody deserves to be abused, and I am really sorry to hear you’ve experienced that and are feeling the after-effects. Do you want to talk a bit about why you feel like you’d be a bad partner? Too, do you have some form of ongoing support surrounding this?

Dating
Agh, I really hear you on this. For what it’s worth, dating apps are just not everyone’s cup of tea. It can be really hard to navigate, and the interface and talking online first is just not for everyone. So, if you don’t like dating apps, that’s totally okay. You’re not alone in that either! Do you have ways you like to meet people in person, or would you like help brainstorming some ideas or ways you might be able to meet people as friends first? Also, when you say you can’t see yourself dating anyone who isn’t a friend, do you mean that you don’t experience romantic attraction, or that you need to feel closer to someone before feeling attraction?



Sorry for all the clarifying questions, I hope that wasn’t too much. I just want to say, too, I hear you saying that your heart feels like it’s sinking, and I want to give you space to talk about that feeling, too, if you’d like. We’re here for you. <3

I appreciate you breaking it down into categories. It honestly helps me collect my thoughts, too.
Gender Identity
I feel like most of the negativity I experience about this is external. I find that a lot of young queer people seem to hold the belief that you must go against all stereotypes. When I attempt to discuss my transition goals in the communities I've been in, it's met with quite forceful pushback, despite my explaining that my desire to present such a way is entirely internal. I know they're not all like this, but I've found myself feeling burnt out and alienated from trying new groups after having to justify my identity to my age and younger. I've considered trying out some of the local support groups, but after years of putting up with that, (I led the group at my school and could therefore not quit.) I always talk myself out of it.
“Genital preference”/Sexual trauma
I know it's a very controversial term, hence my struggle to find any information on it. I know that, personally, I would understand if someone didn't want to date me because of this. It makes sense to call it an orientation rather than a preference. I've always struggled to explain my identity to other people because I'm attracted to all aspects of masculinity. I know that for most people, genitals play a small role in attraction, but for me, I think it ties back to some of the trauma I experienced. Both times were at the hands of AFAB peers, and although I don't have bottom dysphoria (because I can control when I interact with my body and how) the idea of having to be intimate with someone who has a vulva makes me feel sick to my stomach. I don't know how to approach this when dating, either. I don't currently have support because the last (and only) therapist I told about this went about it horribly. I've been trying to build up the courage to go back to therapy after so many bad experiences, and I've started looking online in hopes of finding a wider array of counselors I may connect with.
As I said before, there's often this strange precedent that I am into women based on how I look. This also brings up bad feelings because my mom spent a large portion of my time going through puberty (I don't know if this is the right word to use, but) gaslighting me that I liked women. She would insist that I had a crush on my friend(s) even after I told her I didn't. In 6th grade, I also learned that there was a rumor going around I was into my straight friend, which only seemed to add fuel to the fire. I've talked to my cousin about this, and she told me my mom has had experiences with women but never talks about it (which is her right), but she wondered if that could have played a role in the pressure. The whole experience was strange, and I'm unsure if I'd want to relive it by talking about it with her, considering our relationship is much better now.
Dating
I definitely experience both romantic and sexual attraction, but I need to be close to someone before I'd consider dating them. I struggle to have any non-platonic feelings for anyone I just met, but once I realize I can see myself in a romantic relationship, I always seem to fall fast and hard. I usually struggle to form connections at first, but many of my friendships are 5+ years old. I've been able to form surface-level connections in class, but never really anything that sticks around. This semester, I plan to join clubs and hopefully meet people that way, but I find it difficult to approach people. When I've tried to read things online (because I lost all my in-person friend-making skills to COVID--if I had any in the first place) it always says to "just simply say hi or smile", but I'm very soft-spoken and mask, so I haven't found this technique to be successful for me. I also find that many people at my uni are busy working in common areas, and I struggle to know if and when it's appropriate to approach them.
I also don't think I'd mind meeting someone online first, but I just don't believe that the creators of the apps truly have users' best interests at heart. On top of that, the towns closest to me can be pretty bad (with all the -isms and hate), so I wouldn't exactly feel safe meeting someone that way. We even had to host our second pride in a different town because of backlash.

I really appreciate the support, and it's nice to hear positive stories about male partners. I understand there's a place and time to criticize masculinity (I have done it too after bad experiences), but hearing it discussed so negatively all the time leaves me feeling guilty of my attraction.

I’m glad the categories are helpful for you too!

Gender identity: Thank you for providing those details, this is all really helpful to know. It sounds like you had some really crummy pushback when coming out and discussing your transition — how crappy, and I’m sorry you had this experience when talking about transitioning. The local support groups sound like a great idea, honestly. I think if you can find a more formal support group, led by a professional, that might allow you to discuss things in a space with some clear, set boundaries on respecting your identity and supporting your transition, so people won’t respond with disparaging comments in that space. How has searching for a more inclusive therapist been, too?

Genital preference/sexual trauma: I can definitely understand how the trauma you endured may have an impact on who you experience attraction to. It also sounds like you don’t want to interact with vulvas — that’s totally okay. I think that can be thought of as separate from your sexual identity, though. You can set a boundary that you don’t want to do x sexual acts with vulvas, or don’t want to look at or touch vulvas, and that can be separate from the gender identity of the people you’re attracted to. What genitals someone has doesn’t say anything about their gender identity, and the way we define sexual orientation is how a person usually finds themselves attracted to people based on their expression of gender. You can read more about it here!

I hear you that people often assume you’re interested in women, and I hear you that it feels really bad, and activates memories of your mom saying things about she thinks you like. It can be a really bad and wild feeling when someone insists they know you better than yourself. I would also describe that as a form of gaslighting. But, yeah, it’s definitely possibly and more than likely that those comments were more about her than about you. You know yourself best!

With regard to talking about your sexual identity, it’s really up to how you feel about the words you use to describe your identity, if any. As a start, would you say you’re mostly attracted to people who identify as men, or is it less about gender and more about presentation with masculinity, or something else?

Dating:
Ooh! So, what I’m hearing is that you need to be closer to someone first before considering dating. Is that correct? If so, have you heard of the term demisexual, and how do you feel when people use the term? I’m not saying “this is the term for you,” but it might be helpful to see how some folks describe the feeling of needing to form a closer emotional bond before experiencing sexual attraction. It sounds like you have some really long-lasting friendships, too. Those can be hard to build, and it’s awesome that you have them! It’s good that you know you seek a deeper bond, too. I think, in that case, clubs and like-minded activities would be really good, so you can form long-lasting connections based on mutual interests. It might help, too, with approaching people, because you already have a common thing you’re doing that you can talk or ask about. Are there other aspects of your longer friendships that give you ideas of how to make more friends? How did you meet those friends?

It can certainly be hard to approach people, and I get that masking makes it harder when you want a closer connection. Sometimes when I was in school, I made friends by joining activities in common areas and talking to people who table for clubs and stuff. In common areas, are there times when folks are watching a show or doing something together that you could ask to join?