Fantasies

[jasminetea]

Like many people, I am embarrassed about the content of my sexual fantasies. This site says multiple times that any fantasies we may have are okay and we don’t choose/can’t help what turns us on, which I really appreciate because I have a lot of insecurities about this and don’t always understand why certain things turn me on. But I guess I also think that this line of thinking may be too simple. I really believe that sexual fantasies help us overcome our own personal, specific insecurities and help us become comfortable enough to be vulnerable like we are during sex, partnered or otherwise, but these fantasies can include perceptions of other people that may not be true or healthy. For example, people often fantasize about black men because they are perceived of as more dangerous and sexually powerful or young women because they are perceived of as more innocent and inexperienced, or any other number of other assumptions which are made about any member of a marginalized group. These are drawn upon because the fantasizer needs something provided by the stereotype – to feel desired, or satisfied, or experienced – but they gain these feelings by calling upon harmful perceptions of marginalized groups in our society. This site often mentions the dangers of getting your perceptions about sex from porn, and this problem holds in porn as well, but it isn’t just porn; we receive these messages just by existing in our culture. How is it ethical to fantasize about members of marginalized groups in ways which echo their oppression, especially if you are someone with privilege over the group in question? Wouldn’t these fantasies be wrong? How can you know when your fantasy has crossed this line?

[Keda]

I think this might be a thing where you have to put up with the uncomfortable result (fantasies which rely on harmful stereotypes) while you work on their cause (holding those stereotypes). I think that once you've spent enough time unlearning the -isms, (general) you'd probably find that (general) your sexual fantasies shift away from portyraying a person as, for example, dangerous by way of a racial characteristic, and towards a more diverse cast of imaginaries who portray those kinds of sexual roles through their actions. There is also an element of one of the most effective ways of unlearning -isms being to consciously make the decision to treat people in a way that doesn't fit with the stereotype, but I'm not sure how doable that is the context of sexual fantasies. Maybe it is, though?

The thing about ethics though is that it's not unethical to have a bunch of internalised -isms to begin with, because society kindly gifts all of us with that whether we want it or not. You can certainly decide to challenge them, and I'd definitely applaud that effort, but I'd agree (somewhat indirectly) with the article that it's not wrong to start from a place of "I know young women aren't automatically vulnerable and naive but... goddamnit my brain still defaults to that picture"

[Heather]

I would also add that in general, ethics are about actions, not thoughts. That is for two reasons: one, our thoughts, unless put into action, impact no one but us, and two, we have control over our actions in a way we do not with thoughts.

This is why the idea of Thoughtcrime in George Orwell's 1984 was and remains so terrifying.

[jasminetea]

Thank you for your responses!
Do you have any reading about the ethics of thoughts vs. action? That sounds like a prime topic for a philosophical debate. I think I understand what you are getting at, but I am still worried. (Masturbation is acting on it too, but I can see how you might make a similar argument to the one made with thoughts – it only affects me.) I am mainly asking because I am afraid to let go and really explore my sexuality and what turns me on because I know I may encounter things like this. I have not been that great at recognizing sexism and racism, especially inside myself, in the past. It is difficult to confront these things in ourselves, especially if we may have been enjoying them, like we do in sexual fantasy. I worry about coming to rely on these as part of my own personal sexuality, which I will presumably carry with me one day into partnered sex. But that can’t be right either, can it? Racism and sexism and all the other -isms are not an inherent part of me or my sexuality, as Keda pointed out (thanks Keda!), they are things gifted to me by our culture, and hopefully with practice can be recognized and challenged. Then again, we are all products of our time and place in ways we cannot entirely escape. Now I’m confusing myself. I actually just read this, http://www.scarleteen.com/article/abuse ... se_someone, and while I don’t want to belittle his situation by comparing mine with abuse, I identified with it. I think the way our culture constructs or imagines sex is so often harmful that it can be hard to escape. I am just trying to make sure my sexuality is a positive force in mine and others’ lives.

[Heather]

Your own masturbation, though, still has no impact on anyone else. And again, what you bring into your sexual life with others is a choice, not something that your fantasies dictate. Your sexual life being positive with others will be about what you do, not about what you think, since your thought without action isn't something anyone can even know but you, let alone have as part of their lives with you.

In terms of reading on ethics, it would help to know what education and reading you have done so far about ethics, be that sexual ethics, or just ethics as a larger whole. If you have never read anything basic about ethics, period, I think one thing being missed here might be that ethics are about conduct or behaviour, period.

In other words, the very definition of ethics as a thing is that ethics are about right and wrong (for lack of better words) conduct and behaviour, NOT thoughts. So, there's kind of not going to be a lot about the ethics of thought rather than action, or about them as a versus, because ethics are about conduct, which is action, not thought.

[Heather]

I just realized something else that may help you out with this: when people are doing a truly good job about active consenting, one of the many bonuses of that is that you get to worry way less about -isms playing a part in your sexual life.

In other words, when everyone involved wants to be doing what they are doing, and are treated with the level of respect we afford each other when we truly do consent as a constant, setting up our sexual lives so no one ever has to be part of anything they don't feel good about, you are pretty much going to have your bases covered, because -isms are all about not treating another person as your equal, and not treating another person with respect. As well, relationships that are built and maintained as truly consensual are relationships where there can't be big power imbalances, because if there were, things couldn't actually be very consensual.

Make sense?

[jasminetea]

Sorry for the late reply! I really appreciate your responses. I like what you said about consent, that makes a lot of sense to me. You've helped me a lot. I was raised with a "sow a thought, reap an action" kind of mentality, so I think that might be where I'm getting messed up.