Scarleteen

Hello Scarleteen!

In the light of some of the scandals that have happened this year involving major YouTubers, sexual assault, and their fans, I thought I would ask a question to our community. How do you think we should handle rape culture and/or blatant harassment that seem to exist in social media with little or no consequences?

I especially struggle with this on YouTube, because once in awhile I will catch wind of awful videos that are very demeaning to other people (see: videos that infringe on a person's body without their permission in the name of "comedy"). I never know what to do, because if I click on the video to report it, I have to link in the report where the sexual harassment is taking place, thus I need to watch some of the video. Doing this generates a view, and in turn provides revenue and motivation for the creator to make more videos that are similar. There is never a guarantee that YouTube will take down videos, and even when they do it can take them days if only a few people have reported them. On the flip side, if I refuse to watch the video in order to deny the creator any views, and just complain about it on my own social media, there is even less of a chance that the video will be removed, and more of a chance that my friends will go view the video to see what I am talking about.

As the YouTube community is struggling to identify what content is ok, and what content is not ok, how do you influence that conversation? How do you let people know when their content crosses the line, without giving them a platform to do more harm? How do you handle harmful messages in other kinds of social media, such as Tumblr or Facebook?

(If you are curious as to what scandal I am referring to, you can look at Laci Green's most recent video on YouTube or look her up on Twitter. If I am not allowed to refer people to other places online, please delete this segment of my post or let me know so I can edit it out.)

I think loading or watching a page so you are able to report it is something that you should figure is not contributing to someone's platform or is going to fill their pockets. Especially since what you're doing with that one single load -- which is just that one, not an outlink that can results in thousands or even hundreds of thousands of clicks -- stands counter to all of that.

So, my own best advice is to report to the source when it's a public channel or source (in other words, it's not a private domain using only private video tools). You can also report to the internet service provider for that source -- and if something is totally private, that's the avenue you have to take. Additionally, if you are witnessing any kind of crime online, as with any crime, there is always the option of reporting to the police or another justice system. For instance, here in the states, the FBI has a cybercrime division, and people can use their website to file reports.

Per when you choose to engage directly with someone, that's obviously a judgement call, and one probably mostly based on a) if you feel safe to do so, b) if you think you have the ability to influence them, and c) how much you want to say something directly to that person or source. But per safety, if you're going to do that, IMO, the more public the better, especially since if someone retaliates with any kind of harassment or threat, you will then have paved a path to make that public as well if you chose.

If you don't mind me bumping an extra layer unto this, I think one thing that probably makes all of this feel tricky is how much TV networks and tabloid media are setting precedents for a lot of this. Not tricky per people getting their widdle-minds confused about what is and isn't harassment or assault, as most people doing those things know full well what they're doing, but rather, confusing for people watching who have perhaps gotten in a habit of thinking it's okay for media to do this, or not something anyone can push back with or have any influence over. I wonder what you think about any of that and how it might be playing a part in terms of people's media literacy and their feelings about supporting or being silent with, if not outright crimes, crime-enabling or crime-celebratory media, period? Do you have any sense being saturated in a lot of this from big companies -- whether that company is MTV, Gawker or YouTube -- has normalized it for people in some ways?

(Just FYI, it's okay to outlink to most things anywhere on Scarleteen, so long as a) they're not intended for people over 18 only, and b) they feel, to you, like something sound to link to here. For instance, hopefully it'd be obvious that linking to hate speech or antichoice things -- though I know you likely wouldn't want to, period -- wouldn't be cool. I also personally ask that people please do not link to tabloid media of any kind here, like Gawker and its other web properties or the Daily Mail, because as an organization, we like to do what we can to do some of what you're talking about right here by not supporting things we find harmful or destructive with a batch of traffic. I am not familiar with all of Laci's videos, but from what I know of them and of her, I can't see any of them being any kind of problem at all per linking to them here.)

I wonder what you think about any of that and how it might be playing a part in terms of people's media literacy and their feelings about supporting or being silent with, if not outright crimes, crime-enabling or crime-celebratory media, period? Do you have any sense being saturated in a lot of this from big companies -- whether that company is MTV, Gawker or YouTube -- has normalized it for people in some ways?

Oh for sure. I think many people (including myself) will see something that is obviously harmful, and just ignore it because we feel powerless to change it or are so desensitized to it. For example, Barney in How I Met Your Mother? I love that show, but the more I watched it the more I realized how often Barney took advantage of women who couldn't consent to sex. Yet he is one of the most beloved characters in the show (I too am guilty for liking him in many episodes). In that situation I felt pretty powerless to do anything, other than bring it up to my friends while watching the show together.

I guess I felt so inspired recently by how the YouTube community rallied to basically out a popular channel for blatant sexual harassment. Not only did consumers like me have the videos taken down within the day by reporting, but YouTube superstars publicly denounced him. It was cool to see what we could accomplish together.

But unfortunately, prank videos that involve sexually harassing people on YouTube is almost its own genre, and I think that does desensitize people into thinking that anything is ok if you call it a prank. Hopefully the recent scandal will change that mentality some, and make YouTube (and hopefully other social media) a safer place. I do feel like, as a consumer, I have more power in what content is successful YouTube, because YouTube channels and their profits are fueled directly by views, and consumers have complete control over what content they view (unlike cable, where you are limited to what is on TV at a certain time). If your fans decide that your content isn't something that is worth watching anymore, you are out of a job. However, the desensitization that we have all experienced from mainstream media definitely does play a part in what we consider inappropriate in social media, and every other aspect of our life.

Thanks for being part of our community, too, Kabith. I'm so glad we've got people like you in it!

I'll be interested to read other thoughts in this thread as people chime in.

And I agree: I'd been following some of what's been going on, and you've all done a really good thing here. I'm glad it's something you feel good about, and glad it's also made you, and probably others, feel more of the power you have to influence media and not be bystanders.

I'd add, btw, that calling abuse or harassment a "prank" is sadly not new.

Saying something was a joke, was "just playing around," "just having fun" or any other of a long, long line of rationalizations or excuses when it comes to rape or harassment has an unfortunately long history. Just like "boys will be boys" and similar steaming hot piles of bull$%@&.

As someone who still has yet to own a television proper in her life, and someone who picks their media pretty carefully as a practice, I'm afraid I may be out of the loop with "pranking" as a widespread media genre, though I know it is. Anyone mind giving an old broad an education and filling me in on how much of anything you'd file under "prank" videos or shows is, in fact, some form of abuse, assault or harassment? Sounds like something I should know more about and don't.

Well, I could elaborate on what has bothered me in prank videos in the past.

In general, I classify any "prank" that involves somebody else's body (touching, physically restraining, etc) without their consent (or consent is given, but only after significant pressure and coercion has taken place) is harassment/abuse/assault. I would also consider videos that trick a person into doing or saying something that they did not mean to do or say unethical. Examples include (and these are from real videos): lassoing women on the streets, pinching or groping, handcuffing yourself to another and only taking off the handcuffs in exchange for something (a kiss, hug, phone number, etc), pressuring someone to kiss you by invading their personal space and not letting up until they give in, pressuring someone to do something to someone else (such as kissing/hugging), etc.
Like you said, these tactics sound very familiar, and these channels get away with it because they use the same excuses that you mentioned (boys will be boys, it was all in good fun, etc).

There are plenty of harmless prank videos as well, that don't rub me the wrong way. A video of a guy jogging by and giving someone who is holding their hand out for a taxi a high-five. If someone asks for your phone number you give them a gag number that recites a funny message. Telling someone you want them to watch a really important video when it is really just a RickRoll. Flashmobs. Giving someone plastic food instead of real food so they bite into a plastic grape. I understand that the basic premise of a prank is that the person doesn't see it coming, meaning that consent is generally lacking from the get-go. However, pranks should be set up in a way that doesn't threaten a person, and also allows the person to walk away from the interaction without feeling shame, pressure, or discomfort. Anything that we firmly believe requires consent should not be the subject of a prank. As a YouTube channel that is entirely based on pranks, I feel as if it is the duty of the creators to film pranks that do not violate people's rights to their bodies and freedom.

I hope I answered your question

Very much so, thank you!

Youtube stuff tends to be entirely outside my radar, but after you posted this, kabith, I went and found out what Laci Green was talking about. Ugh.

All of you who've reported this or otherwise campaigned about it have made a big difference, it seems to me. In the last 24 or so hours, it's in various national UK media (the guy in question is UK-based). Sadly, I haven't seen a mainstream media piece yet that I'd want to link here, because they're either too surface-y or because they have one or more videos by this guy embedded... nope. The overall representation is definitely that he's done something unpleasant and wrong, if that helps you to know. Unfortunately, the attention is mostly on just the one video rather than the others, but... baby steps. I think it also becomes part of a recent shift in UK mainstream media - a slow but very significant shift - where sexual assault of all kinds is taken more seriously, recognised more, and people who've been assaulted receive more support and belief. At least two women have also spoken out about harrassment and serious assault by him against them, in a personal sphere; at least as far as I can see, so far in the mainstream, they're being taken as credible, and I think that (and the fact that they've spoken up now in the first place) has a lot to do with the attention you've all drawn to his self-broadcast behaviour.

I was disgusted to hear that his "defence" of the video was that it was pre-arranged with the woman and that he'd intended to point out the difference in reactions to assault of women and assault of men. Even if that's the truth (ahem, Even If...), that's gross. a) grabbing and groping women is still commonplace and commonly excused, so the point doesn't really hold up, and b) what in the Hell that's a terrible way of arguing against harrassment and assault of men - instead of spreading more images which appear to be of assaults of women, why not just speak out against assault of men? People of any gender who are harrassed or assaulted get a crap deal, so why not speak against All assault (sure, with a big focus on male victims if that's your thing) rather than further harming a bunch of people who'd agree with you? Bleh. Gross bloke, I don't believe you.

Didn't want to take the conversation away from the social media/video aspects of this, and please do continue! But kabith, particularly considering the drops-in-an-ocean way it can feel, and the enormous amount of vile pushback that can happen among some of the vocal people on social media, wanted you and others to know that your action here has a wider impact.

With regard to the question you asked, kabith - "...how do you influence that conversation? ... How do you handle harmful messages in other kinds of social media...?"

Being super-active against this is just not "my" thing, not the best use of my personal energy (it rapidly grinds me into the ground). But on Facebook, for example, there's still a little I can do. There Are people - groups and individuals, formal and informal - who take action about harmful content of all kinds. When I know where to find any of them, just dropping them a link to a harmful thing I came across and reporting it myself is the action I take. I'm under no illusions that just one report is going to achieve much, but I do think that a collection of actions can make a difference in the long-term. I've lost count of the number of "we've reviewed this content and are taking no action at this time"-type responses I've received, but sometimes that same content gets removed later after there was a bigger fuss. The more people who say something isn't ok, the more other people hear it and maybe start to think about it, and sometimes, slowly, opinions and what's socially acceptable change. More immediately, some folk are Good at this and knowledgeable, and apply pressure to businesses that are advertising on social media, for example - sometimes just drawing attention to what content their adverts appear with, sometimes pointing out a swell of public opinion against that content and suggesting that it would be bad for business to be associated with it. When there's unhappiness from advertisers and big money in the picture... sometimes a business like facebook takes more notice a bit sooner.

I totally agree on everything that you have said about the youtuber, and I think most people (other than his fans) are pretty convinced that he isn't what he is pretending to be. I don't mind the conversation about him either, or conversations calling out people's BS. His actions were not consistent with his "message", plain and simple. It is confusing and damaging, it does not help further a "cause."

Contacting advertisers is brilliant! I use AdBlock on my computer, so I never see ads on social media, but I really like the idea of using money to (our dollars are supposed to be our vote, in a perfect capitalistic society anyway) to sway bigger entities to drop things that we as a community consider offensive. I would have never thought of that.

I also agree that being active on social media can be extremely draining. It is also very hard to walk away from, and sometimes I am guilty of getting too wrapped up in it. Buuuuut I also tell myself that social media is a huge part of people's lives now (at least the lives of my generation), and making little changes can have a huge ripple affect. In fact, get this... A GUY ON REDDIT ACTUALLY ADMITTED THAT RAPE CULTURE WAS A THING. The whole youtuber scandal was enough evidence for him to see the affects of rape culture in a very public space, and made a thread discussing it with other people who had previously not believed in its existence. Even though it was probably just five dudes who browse the internet all day long, that is still five people whom moved from one end of the spectrum to the other just because of an experience they had on social media. (This is a really big deal because Reddit is known for it's dismissive and even hateful views of many social injustices, so the fact that some members of the community are admitting to the problem is almost unbelievable). SO COOL. /end nerdiness

You've probably already seen this, kabith, but I thought it was a pretty spot-on parody and callout!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1WqkJqOOyKQ