Previous emotional abuse

[Animallover95]

Hi I was on here a while ago about another subject but from a little research about my feelings towards sex it seems I’ve had previous sexual abuse?! Never psychically just emotional, but It sounds really dramatic and I feel quite ashamed to believe that. But my ex boyfriend threatened to rape and beat me after I refused sex with him, we weren’t together long two weeks max and I’m glad we werent but for some reason his words and threatening has affected me more now than ever, I break down and cry I feel anxious and scared and hopeless! I don’t know if it’s because I’m in a serious relationship with my current partner or just my thoughts about boys and men in general. I just feel like men are only interested in sex and if I was to say never to have sex again none would be with me which I find very disturbing and quite disgusting, I feel like sex is just one thing out of 10 in a relationship and if it doesn’t happen that fine I’m cool with it, but I feel like men would die if they never have sex.is this me not living in the real world or is there something wrong with me? It’s really hard for me to get over!

[Heather]

It's certainly understandable that you're having a a hard time after this. What you have posted here would absolutely create trauma and impact from that for most people.

Obviously, how one man behaves doesn't tell you anything reliable about the other 4 billion or so men in the world. And for certain, just like it isn't true of women, we know that most men and boys are interested in far more than sex in both their lives as a whole and when it comes to women. For sure, saying no to sex to men doesn't mean that all men you say no to will then want nothing to do with you (though for sure, any who were like that would be fish to throw back like you thankfully were able to do with your ex). Men also certainly will not die without sex: that's simply not true about anyone.

So, those things aren't realistic about all, or even most, men and they also aren't true about all or even most men. However, sometimes people are inclined to generalize like that in response to a bad or traumatic experience with a person or group of people -- be it their gender, their race, the color of their eyes, what they do for a living, where they're from. It can take some time -- and some healing first -- to be able to remind yourself that generalizing about people is rarely sound or true. The quasi-good news is that you usually can move past that, and in the meantime, unless you're using generalizations in a way that's hurtful to people -- like to abuse them or keep them from things like housing -- these thoughts likely aren't hurting anyone but you.

It also sounds like it's possible that being in something *now* might have brought some feelings back from your trauma: you may be scared, for instance, that your boyfriend now is the kind of person this ex was (particularly if he's behaving in any way that seems to validate your fears). Being in a serious relationship all by itself can also be scary, and it can sometimes feel like you might be trapped in it if things go south. For people who have survived any kind of abuse or trauma, that can be extra scary.

Have you yet resolved anything we were talking about with you here: http://www.scarleteen.com/bb/viewtopic. ... 682#p40628 or even just started talking to your boyfriend about all of that so things can change? If not, it certainly makes sense you are having hard feelings like this right now, and they may well be as much about your current relationship as they are about this ex. Maybe even more so, depending on where things stand. You have also posted about some things your current has said and ways he has behaved that I can see in some of those generalizations.

Also, if you are still having sex you still do not want for yourself at all (which probably is also more about your current long-term relationship than what happened with this ex of a couple weeks years before), that all by itself usually is going to leave people feeling hopeless and sad, feeling the kinds of feelings you are, because that is how being in that position tends to feel. It generally does feel really bad to be in the kind of spot you've been in, especially over so much time.

You say what happened with this ex has been hard for you to get over. Can you tell me a little bit about what you've done to do some processing and healing? It's sounding to me like you may have only just very recently even realized this was abuse and something that deeply impacted you in the first place: do I have that right?

[Animallover95]

Hi heather thank you for replying I don’t feel as pathetic knowing that it’s normal to feel the way I am I just feel like it was such a long time ago and I know he’s probably forgot all about it but yes my current boyfriend of 4 years sometimes doesn’t think before he speaks, he sometimes says that he wouldn’t be with me if I didn’t do this or if I looked like that and it really upset me when he especially said that if it wasn’t for sex he wouldn’t be with me and that just made me feel used if anything but I just put it down to my past and that it’s not his fault. He does look after me though more than I ever could imagine actually, just simple things like bringing home chocolates for us to share. But yeah it makes sense that that may be why these feelings are coming back from the past so I will tell him next time when he’s took it too far for my feelings. As for getting over I never really liked him really it’s just hard to start trusting someone and then for them to act like that it came a shock but I thought that was all and nothing more but since I’ve found out it’s a form of sexual assault I’ve never actually seemed help not thinking I needed it and maybe just some boost of self esteem but I may seem that that may be the way forward to stop these feelings rushing back.

[Animallover95]

I just want to clarify that I spoke first about sex to him for him to make that reply saying how sex made me feel after my previous experience and he said he couldn’t be with me without sex and I remember just freezing cos it hurt me but I can’t expect him to hurt because of what happened to me. Ps sorry for the long essay

[Heather]

I will come back to also talking about the ex if you want, but I really do think it's sounding like what might actually be happening is you're thinking about that so maybe you don't have to think about what is going on in your CURRENT relationship. Sometimes we -- we meaning people -- do that: we will project a thing unto something else because it's easier or less scary or sad for us to deal with than to deal with what is actually happening. I think that's probably what you're doing here.

Looking at your response just now, combined then with your previous threads, I hear you saying that your current has, in fact, told you that "if it wasn't for sex he wouldn't be with you," or put conditions on being with you based on how you look. Saying you can't expect him to hurt -- which isn't even about him hurting, because it sounds like you mean he is saying hurt = not have sex -- because of your previous sexual trauma is a really insensitive, self-centered, and pardon me, but really freaking gross thing to say to someone when they disclose trauma to you. I'm so sorry you had to go through someone responding to you like that about this. That's terrible.

Bringing home chocolates to share doesn't fix that or automatically make this a nice or healthy relationship. Things like that -- and obviously other things that have this kind of dynamic, or else you probably wouldn't have gone so many years without sharing information like that you don't want to have sex with him, something people in healthy relationships feel able to share -- don't make the kinds of things he's been saying NOT emotionally abusive.

What you described with your ex -- that threat -- wasn't assault (assault is physical). But it was abuse. However, it probably did not have as big an impact on you, given how short it was and that you got out so fast (good for you, btw!), as this relationship and it's four years of some of these dynamics have. This isn't about your boyfriend "going too far sometimes." Comments like that are always not okay, as is -- like I mentioned in your other thread -- never even ASKING your sexual partner basic questions like what they want. At best, it sounds like you've had something that's just mostly been pretty crummy, and that you have set very low expectations for intimate relationships, like someone cuddling you sometimes or looking after you (which can be as much a form of control as care, depending). But I suspect it's actually been more than just crummy. I'm hearing tidbits in all of this that sound emotionally abusive to me.

I'm sorry to ask the same question again, but I actually think it's important: were you able to talk to this boyfriend about any of the things you, myself and other staff were talking about in your other thread yet? If not, and if that's because you still just don't feel emotionally safe doing so -- for instance, you worry he'll leave you if you say you don't want to just have sex because he wants it, or that he'll be a jerk when you say you need him not to blow off talking about your feelings -- I think it's really important you recognize something is very wrong here, in this relationship, right now. And that focusing on a way-past trauma probably isn't a way to go, especially if you don't want to be in something that is at least as bad for you, and has probably been far worse, especially since you're so deep and so long in it.

[Heather]

You don't need to be sorry. I'm glad you're telling us about this. I'm glad you're telling someone, period. It matters. YOU matter.

[Animallover95]

Wow although it was hard to read it does make sense, although he is really sweet and I know he cares about me it’s much more than chocolates believe me I do feel safe around him but he’s not the best at thinking things through and I think he forgets what I’ve been through and his memory is really bad anyway. Going back to what you said about the ‘talking’ I haven’t yet built up the confidence to talk to him but I have made suggestions from the previous thread which have worked Slowly but I can feel closer with him sexually now, but yeah the talking we’re both not very good at as I’ve tried in the past but he just brushes it off and talks about something else but I don’t know if he just feels awkward or if something triggers something in his past too as he’s told me his previous girlfriend had cheated on him so I know that would’ve been hard for him. Overall I’m quite new to relationaships they’ve ended in disaster with just weeks apart and this is my first serious and I’m subconsciously aware that he’s had many girlfriends and he turns thirty next year so there’s quite an age gap too but that’s never really bothered me apart from experience.

[Heather]

I'd like to keep talking with you about this if you're still open to it. But I'm feeling kind of confused between your posts here, and the response you left to your other thread here: http://www.scarleteen.com/bb/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=7978

In that response, it sounds like you have talked about all or most of this, but in the ones here, it sounds like you haven't. I want to make sure I'm giving you the right advice, and I can't really do that if I'm not sure what's happening. I also feel like I'm missing some history here that might be helpful.

Would you mind both catching me up to what's been going on in your relationship over the last month, and maybe also be willing to give me more of a whole history of this relationship, like how you met, how it became sexual, and how it has progressed between then and now?

[Animallover95]

Sorry I’ve been absent for days, we first met at his pub where he works, he used to work on the bar and we got talking and decided to have a date together. I wasn’t 100% comfortable because I gave in with boys and men after my past but I felt pressured by family and friends, and decided to give a try. Few days after we went the the cinema in the afternoon and then went to his which was just up the road I was very quiet and shy but he was sweet and took his time, I think he knew what I was thinking and he said don’t worry my dad is home I’m not planning anything. I decided to go ahead and go to his and I met his dad who is lovely even now! I remember being nervous but he was just showing me his guitar and playing it. Nothing really happened I remember him walking me home and hugging me goodbye and said he wanted to see me again.

We were seeing each other for about a month before we had our first kiss we kissed outside my house before he went home. I finally felt like he wanted me much more than sex so I relaxed a little more with him.

There was lots of cuddling when we were watching films there was lots of affection just him kissing my forehead made me tingle! I started to fall for him but I knew that sex would come sooner or later and I kinda wanted to get it over and done with.

For some reason when ever we were cuddling in bed I always felt like he was gonna make a move and when he did I was so nervous especially when he kissed my neck started touching me and then I could feel him wanting more and I just froze and he carried on but I couldn’t say anything, he almost put it in but he didn’t because I think he knew I was scared. Then he started to pull my leggings back up and I remember being relieved but wondered why he stopped as he never spoke to me but I guess my actions told him I wasn’t ready.

He never spoke about himself it’s been his dad explaining his past and what he likes and doesn’t like so it’s like Chinese whispers sometimes. But his dad said that he doesn’t talk much, he only seems to talk when something is bothering him he said it’s just the way he is.

[Animallover95]

I’m really new to long term relationships so I don’t really know what’s right and what’s wrong, I remember when I first said that I were threatened he said that no one would talk to me like that ever again and then he said that his ex as cheated on him after 3 years, but we never spoke about our past after that until recently. When ever I’m ever upset now and talk about getting help he just agrees and says it’ll make me feel better but nothing else is said and I feel like it’s just forgotten about so then I overthink and think I’m pathetic which made me think about what you said with it being more my current. Is he avoiding talking about it? Does it make him uncomfortable? Does he think I’m pathetic? All these thoughts I keep thinking about but it just makes it worse! Sorry for going on x

[Heather]

It's okay.

I think I might need a day or so to just marinate on all of this, though, which I hope is okay. I'm not operating on much today, and I want to be able to give you better focus.

[Animallover95]

Yeah that’s absolutely fine I’ve given you a lot of information and I’m sorry for going on. Let me know if you have questions about anything, and thank you for your time and help Heather!

[Heather]

No need to be sorry! I asked questions, and I'm glad you've answered them and are talking. Thanks for being understanding about my limited bandwidth!

[Animallover95]

I understand there’s not just me on here that needs help and others may need more urgent help I don’t mind waiting I’m just glad someone is taking their time to help me how ever long it takes

[Heather]

Sorry to keep you waiting so long, and to come back with yet another question. But I feel like there's one more piece missing for me.

Can you tell me a little about how you FEEL in this relationship most of the time? Without comparing it to any other relationship, how do you feel in this most of the time? Do you feel happy, secure, loved, and appreciated for who you are? Do you feel very emotionally supported? Do you feel able to just be yourself, and feel very comfortable being yourself?

Or, do you more often feel unhappy, insecure, unloved or only loved very conditionally, and not appreciated for the person you are? Do you not feel emotionally supported? Do you feel like you can't just relax and be yourself (including looking how you look without doing anything)?

Or is it a mix of those things, or somewhere in between?

[Animallover95]

Hi heather I feel happy with him and he treats me better than I ever could believe, I can’t imagine my life without him. We laugh a lot and I know I can be myself around him, we know how to make each other laugh! I do feel appreciated but it’s hard to be completely sure as we don’t live together (yet) as we both live with our parents, but I’m starting to share more with him about how I’m feeling, if I’m feeling low for example, he does comfort me and tells me he is always there for me. But again I feel like that disappears the next day but he might forget or think I’m fine again.

I don’t always feel like he puts me first as he is greedy when it comes to money. He’s had a gambling problem in the past and I’ve recently found out he’s been battling debt, as I asked how he was with money as we’ve spoke about saving for our own place and he confessed to gambling. I supported him getting a non interest loan to pay it off as I knew it was a relief to start getting rid of it. I used this to try and open him up about how he’s feeling and that I’m here to help him and support him and he’s thankful but I still feel like he hides a lot. Which for someone like me with insecurities I put it down to me that’s doing something wrong!

We never shouted at each other or argued over anything so I can’t understand why he’s holding back from me, do I need to be more forceful?

I’m always at my best with him but when it comes to sexual contact I’m a little more awkward I never know how to react or what to say as I think there’s so much pressure about sex nowadays and as I’ve said in my previous post it’s hard for me to relax and I guess that’s why it was hard or me to get arroused by him.

It seems like it’s getter better as we’ve tried new things, we’ve tried foreplay more which has helped as before I felt like he wanted to dive straight in and I felt used, but he’s taking time to listen to me and I’m telling him what feels good. Ironically he’s not tried when he comes home from work like he used to as our bodyclocks are different I was always asleep when he came in and I used to feel pressured to have sex with him, I do feel more confident to say no if that ever happens as I do feel like he would accept it as before I was scared he would do it anyway.

So overall it’s a mixture but I’m overall very happy with him and I want to make it work, I just wished he’d open up more to me and talk because I feel like I’m picking at his brain all the time to get answers.

Hope this makes sense and feel free to ask any further questions and I will happily get back to you! Thank you Heather

[Heather]

Thanks so much for sharing all of that with me.

I keep asking so many questions because, to be honest, I've just been having a hard time getting a read on if this is a healthy relationship or not. I don't feel like it has been healthy sexually, if for no other reason than my sense is that for most of it, you have been having sex you didn't even want and he's been having sex with you in a way that...well, it sounds like was all about him, and not about him even checking to see what you even wanted, including if you wanted sex at all. It has sounded like you haven't felt able to say no or to be honest, and I'm not sure if you have been really honest yet still (like if you have told him you have been having sex you don't want to most of the time, and how you have felt pressured to because he said he wouldn't be with you otherwise). There have been some attitudes displayed here by both of you that haven't seemed sexually healthy to me.

But.

For one, unless you're withholding information or I'm misreading this, it sounds like in every other area of this relationship, it's been good for you, and good for you on the regular. It sounds like it has a lot of what you want in it (and I hear you with laughing: that's a very important thing for me in intimate relationships, too). It sounds like you both have some communication issues with intimacy, but it sounds like some efforts have been made around that and that may be improving. It also sounds like something is changing in your sex life, so that may be getting better.

It's always a bit hard to know what to say about a relationship that seems great in some respects and problematic -- even to the point of being emotionally unhealthy -- in others. However, you two have been together a long time, and I know at least one of you (you) are very invested in it and willing to put some serious work into it. If that's also true about him, given how long you've been together and how serious this is, I think my best advice might be to see if you can have a talk with him and ask him if he'd be willing to work with you on some parts of the relationship that are a problem: maybe with a counselor, maybe with some books, etc. I think that if he's down for that, and actually starts putting the kind of effort into this that you are (just look at all this time you have spent on the boards about this!), then this just might be one of those that can get turned around, even in its problem places.

How does any of that feel to you?

[Animallover95]

Hi heather, i would love to make this work but given what you’ve said about intimacy now to think of it I think I’m partly to blame for him not talking, I get really embarrassed about anything with sex, like I hate movies with sex scenes in them, any sex jokes, or anything related to sex I just feel so nervous and anxious and a little anger too. I put that down to my past but maybe I’m just living in a different world and won’t accept sex for what it is. I was strictly brought up so I guess you could consider me a (good girl) I always dreamed sex was about love between a man and a woman but after what I been through and seen on websites and films its just a lot different from what I thought it would be. I don’t know maybe I need to grow up still but how I react to my partner in relation to sex I actually think I’m the problem sometimes.

I remember when we were first going out he spanked me for a joke and I freaked out at him not to do it again, and when he tried anal with me I strictly told him not to and I remember crying for days after not believing what he wanted! Maybe it’s the way I react to him that stops him opening up but I don’t understand spanking, anal, or being dominated or any of that stuff I just find it very disturbing if anything, what happened to just sex?! I thought it was very simple and romantic but It’s just all very complicated for me and I obviously want to satisfy him but am I hard to work with? Does he want to explore stuff like that? I guess it frightens me that much that I avoid talking about it worrying what the answer might be.

I don’t know if you get many people like me not been interested in them things, I get dressing up kind of, it’s like guys in suits for girls but anything after that just creeps me out. It’s kinda an eye opener for me realising that my problems about sex could be the answer to him being quiet, I’m afraid of what he’ll say if I ask and in return I don’t know what I’d answer!

I’ve been exploring on websites for seducing and sex advice on ‘turn on’ points I find it hard to believe they actually work, have I got a low sex drive? I just find it takes a lot for me to get turned on.

Im sorry if this a lot of information and if it’s not relevant to anything above but I’ve just been thinking about it for a few days and wondered if this can be fixed or even improved. And if this is the answer to a lot of questions. I actually feel quite embarrassed to speak about this subject but if it solves a lot of answered questions then it was worth it and if not well we’ll keep trying to figure it out.

Thanks Heather and sorry again for rambling on!

[Mo]

It sounds like the idea of talking about sex with your partner is pretty intimidating or embarrassing to you, but I do think that's going to be the key here. You say you're afraid to ask him if he's interested in things like spanking or anal sex, but I think if you're worried about this, or about why he might be interested in them, talking about it is going to be a good idea. Even if you get an answer you aren't thrilled with, it's probably better to know an answer than to spend time worrying about what it might be!

Before you have sex again, it's going to be a good idea to take some time to sit down with him and really talk about how you feel about sex, what you want out of sex or a sexual relationship (or even if you are interested in sex for yourself, vs because you want to make him happy, at all), and how you can move forward with a healthier dynamic and better communication. If he isn't willing to seriously engage with this topic, or if you truly do feel too embarrassed or anxious to talk openly about it, then I don't think you're both in the right headspace to be sexual with each other right now.

[Animallover95]

Thank you I shall try and talk to him, I don’t know why I feel like this but you’re right there might not be a reason for me to worry, I’ll let you know it goes. Thank you

[Animallover95]

Hi me again, I’ve just had a chat with him (he’s gone home now) about what he likes in the bedroom and what he doesn’t like etc, I used Christmas as an example to dress up so it didn’t look out of the blue so I said is there anything that you would like me to do? Like outfits wise and he said he likes everything, not really giving me much so I said okay what don’t you like and we got as far as latex, he doesn’t like latex so at least that’s something out of him.

There was a bit of awkward silence in between just watching telly in the background like he wasn’t really keen to talk about it. I kept trying to get more out of him but he just kept saying ‘anything surprise me’ and all this, and I was hoping that he’d ask me the same but nope no thought about what I like at all, even though I don’t actually know what I like I still want to be asked. I kept trying to talk and he said he didn’t want to talk about it as it was making him horny but I just ignored him and carried on so I just said I don’t like anything too rough like spanking, anal etc and he agreed which is good. So again I asked anything else? He said that anything I wear is sexy and that I don’t need to try and ‘impress’ him, he said he won’t last too long if I did dress up for him. I think he was being sweet and just trying not to offend me by saying that, otherwise I may feel like I never satisfy him. He also said it was exciting when we did it in the car. My heart sank a little as yeah it was good to try it but I struggle to relax as it is and I have anxiety so trying to be hidden in a car in the town we’re in is pretty difficult, and I couldn’t concentrate because I was panicking too much.

Anyway back to the conversation he mentioned doing it again and he pulled my arm (gently) and told me to come with him. I didn’t show much enthusiasm on purpose but he kept asking me to go with him and that we won’t be long and at this point I thought he was gonna beg. So I made an excuse and said that it was late and that I’m up at 5 and I felt guilty saying it as I felt like I let him down. But he didn’t ask after that but I could tell he was disappointed. I don’t know if I’m more upset with myself or him for how he acted. How could this conversation have gone better? Or is he just really awkward to talk to, is there anything I’m doing wrong?

[Mo]

I think what would have been needed for things to go better was for him to be more engaged in the conversation, and more willing to talk with you about this. I don't think there's anything you're doing wrong, here; you can open that conversation, but there isn't a way to make him take part in it if he isn't interested, sadly.

It sounds like he wasn't very invested in asking how you're feeling about anything sexual, and I think that's something that has to happen if you're going to build a relationship that's sexually satisfying/enjoyable for you. As Heather said above, it sounds like he hasn't been focusing much (if at all) on your pleasure and desires around sex, and you've been having sex you weren't really into, and that just isn't going to be a way to have a healthy sexual relationship. Do you feel like this aspect is something you can talk to him about?

[Animallover95]

I certainly feel like he doesn’t really care (he probably does or I’m hoping) but I don’t feel it. But I feel like engaging this conversation will open a lot more doors on things he needs to open up about too. Like if I’m feeling down he doesn’t ask why just that he’s there and he’ll support me but again I don’t feel like he cares. I don’t know if it’s just me over exaggerating but it’s how he makes me feel sometimes. But I don’t know how to start the conversation positively, I don’t like arguing and I hate shouting and I don’t want it to get that far. I’ve been trying to think of healthier ways like not just blaming or making all about him that’s doing something wrong, and maybe asking him if anything I’m doing wrong to make him feel uncomfortable does this sound like a good idea? I’ll try and think of ways to talk to him like this if so. I’ve tried friendly chat to talk and if that isn’t working then I might have to step it up and talk a little more serious maybe that way he might actually listen

[Mo]

You know, I think trying to frame this question as "am I dong anything wrong" isn't going to be a good approach. It's ok to say directly to someone, someone you're in a relationship who presumably cares about you and your feelings, "I don't feel like you're focusing on my pleasure at all during sex" or "I haven't enjoyed [x kind of sex] so I need to step back and take a break from it for a bit." These aren't bad things to say to someone, and they are things that really HAVE to be said for things to improve!
If he deflects or ignores these statements, or says he'll change his behavior and then doesn't - those aren't signs that you're doing something wrong here, they'd be signs that he just isn't ready to be in a healthy sexual relationship. If he just won't listen, that's a bit of an answer in itself, sadly.

[Animallover95]

Thank you I shall try, I don’t know why I find it so hard to talk to him. I just wished he saw things from my point of view.