Scarleteen

hi, i think this is a good place to talk? hopefully there’s others on here who understand or have advice so i’m somewhere on the asexual spectrum, i’m definitely homoromantic and am absolutely in seek/desire of a romantic relationship. im talking to a girl on bumble and she’s great!

i told her i’m ace and she’s been really nice about it! she’s flirty (in a respectful way) and i want to be back but is that in a sense agreeing to be sexual? does that make sense? like i’m a cheesy flirter and i like the whole good morning cutie things and i always do them! but is that bad to do as i stated sex is off the table? i told her i’m looking for a companionship. i said i wasn’t going to talk to anyone anymore or try to date and here i am, and here i am overthinking againnnnn.

Hey sky: I'm not ace, but holler back at me if you want my input on this anyway. <3

i do! i always value your opinion/advice no matter what

Hi, sky. I am asexual. =)

The only thing that's agreeing to be sexual is explicitly agreeing to be sexual - and even then, minds can change at any moment and consent revoked whenever.

Flirting is not an allosexual only thing. You're not barred or banned from flirting because you're asexual. You're totally allowed to flirt.

Flirting is also not some binding contract agreeing to sex or romance. For some people, it is more serious and for others, it is more casual.

I think it's also great that you were honest and told this girl you're looking for companionship. It sounds like you really feel safe talking to her, and that she's been overall respectful and accepting of you.

One thing you might think about is what you want from this. I'm not sure if it's just the overthinking or if there are other underlying reasons, but there seems to be a lot of confliction and worry here over flirting with this girl even though you've been honest about how you feel and what you're looking for. Maybe just spend some time making sure you're comfortable with where things are going?

thank you for all that

i guess i’m overthinking and nervous because i have a tendency of not doing anything really and getting harassed. i know being harassed isn’t that terrible to some but sometimes it is pretty bad for me. i guess i’m just kind of scared of that. no matter what happens i always think it’s my fault and i don’t really want to have to deal with all that pain and confusion again. that’s why flirting/showing interest scares me

=)

It's absolutely not necessary to put yourself down for not enjoying harassment. Harassment is always a big negative. I mean, "aggressive pressure or intimidation" sounds really, really not great to go through. D: Just because different people handle harassment differently doesn't mean you need to beat yourself up for being impacted by harassment! It's okay to just... feel your feelings.

Maybe talking this over in some manner with this girl would help you? You don't have to share anything with her that you don't want, but maybe saying something like, "hey, I really enjoy talking with you and I wanna flirt with you a bit, but I've had some bad experiences in the past when I do that, so I just wanna check in with you. Would it be okay if I sent you stuff like 'good morning cutie'?"

i just made it all easier and stopped talking to her.

horriblegoose basically said what I was going to! Flirting -- or being cheeky or playful -- doesn't = sex or have to be about sex. It also certainly isn't a promise of sex.

sky wrote:i just made it all easier and stopped talking to her.

That doesn't sound easier. It sounds like a panic reaction. It sounds self-defeating and self-destructive, unfair to both of you, and honestly incredibly hurtful to this girl. Are you cutting her off with no word? Did you give her some freaked out speech about how you can't talk to her anymore? Either way, how upsetting for her!

Pushing people away before you can get hurt isn't actually going to protect you from getting hurt (or hurting others). It's just gonna end up with you isolated and alone - and that's not going to feel good. =(

she responded to me and i just didn’t respond back. she has a boyfriend, she’s poly and is talking to other people on the app, she’ll be okay, she’ll find the girl she’s looking for i’m not the person she’s looking for that’s certain.

That's... kind of not even the point.

First off, that doesn't address that this is potentially self-destructive behavior for you and will not actually protect you from hurt. The thing about closing yourself off from things (people, experiences, etc.) is that you can't pick and choose. If you close yourself off, you may think you're protecting yourself from being hurt... but you're also blocking yourself off from all the potentially good and amazing people and experiences.

Second off, it doesn't matter how many people are in your life, ghosting at any stage in a relationship is very hurtful and upsetting.

Finally, I really don't think it's fair or right to pretend that you did this for this girl somehow or determine for her that you're not one of the people she's looking for or would be happy with. She is her own person and she gets to decide who and what is right for her. You have the power for yourself to do the same and choose who and what is right for you - but you cannot decide that for other people. And considering how excited you were earlier in this post and how safe you seemed to feel talking to her, "i just made it easier" does not at all sound like the reason you made this decision was because you felt she was somehow off or not right for you.

I just think you deserve to treat yourself way better than all of this.

i understand what you mean. i’m just at a point in my life where i kind of don’t trust anyone. i always self destruct, that’s what i’m good at. i’m just tired of all the shitty experiences, i don’t believe good ones exist. especially when i’m afraid of everything regarding sex and all this world is, is sex. i would rather just be alone forever. i’m good at being alone

By all means, if you would really rather be alone, then you can choose to be. You are not required to seek out and engage in intimate relationships.

But you have kept seeking them out, and you have also talked a lot here about being lonely. So, can you maybe take a second to re-state what you really do or don't want so it's honest? I get being afraid of being hurt again and again: that's real! But I'm not so sure I buy that you want to be alone, just because that seems very different than what you have been saying here and what you have been choosing. <3

i don’t know what i want i don’t think. i have the perfect person in my life and i’m madly in love with her but she’s married and has children and grand kids. i’m 22 and she’s 58. she knows how i feel about her and we’ve remained friends. she constantly tells me that i need to get out there and try to date and i just repeatedly tell her that no one is her. no one will ever be her. i guess if i can’t have her then i don’t want anyone. and i won’t ever have her. also, if i don’t date girls and i don’t ever have to actually deal with the facts of me being ace then it’s not actually real.

You know, although I'm not ace myself, I've known a few people who identify as asexual who have had fulfilling relationships and the main thing they've said has helped them was working on their confidence on their boundaries then putting themselves out there. Actually, I dated someone who was ace, and for me, at the time it wasn't an issue for me, it was easy to respect their boundaries and what they wanted in terms of we didn't really even kiss (granted, we were even younger than I am now) and honestly, that kind of cutesy, cuddly relationship is what we had, I don't regret it in the slightest, although I had to deal with some major BS from a jealous abuser because of it. Avoidance has been a problem for me in other areas in my life and learning to face it was extremely helpful, avoiding things especially if they form around trauma which from reading your other posts I think you've had to deal with oftentimes just make it worse in the long run. But avoidance is certainly what I'm seeing a lot of in your posts.

It can be really hard to accept or have to deal with ignorant people, which it sounds like you've had to deal with a lot of, but I've found as time goes on you get pretty good at telling when it's a good time to say "f off" - It can be annoying, but it helps.

We live in a pretty sexualized world honestly (or at least that's how it kind of feels to me), and what you're saying or I guess, what I'm understanding is that it can be hard for you? I think I'm understanding it right, but please let me know if I'm off. It can certainly be tricky and it makes sense where those feelings would come from. I really had to learn for myself to tell the world that I could do whatever I wanted, and for right now, that's not be in a relationship and not care what other people think about it. It's not an easy thing to do though, and part of it just comes from me being a rather loud, vocal person, even so it took time to learn.

What I started doing every morning when this got hard for me was looking in the mirror in the morning, and asking myself who else is there to judge me. Then noticing all the things I had to feel about my body and questioning myself as to whether it was the world pushing me down or me, and saying to myself that the only person I could 100% guarantee would be there was myself, and that I was the only person who mattered in that moment. I don't know if that was a good way to explain it, but it made one hell of a difference on my confidence. I wonder as well, would maybe challenging yourself to do one act of self care a day, maybe doing one of those cute pinterest jars with quotes that you might need to hear and opening that once a day, or maybe pushing yourself to do one thing to put yourself out there or work on standing up for yourself and what you believe in or maybe something that scares you every so often?

I hope it was okay I jumped in there, I just really noticed a lot that I really did quite relate to. You deserve to be happy, feel safe and feel loved, however that is.

I'm not really sure what to say about the person you're interested in, I'm sorry, I don't have any expertise or prior knowledge/experience around that.

sky wrote:i don’t know what i want i don’t think. i have the perfect person in my life and i’m madly in love with her but she’s married and has children and grand kids. i’m 22 and she’s 58. she knows how i feel about her and we’ve remained friends. she constantly tells me that i need to get out there and try to date and i just repeatedly tell her that no one is her. no one will ever be her. i guess if i can’t have her then i don’t want anyone. and i won’t ever have her. also, if i don’t date girls and i don’t ever have to actually deal with the facts of me being ace then it’s not actually real.

I think it makes sense that you feel very conflicted on what you want because you're telling yourself one thing but acting in another way and admitting how you feel would be a very big, scary step and might mean that you'd have to start work on aligning your actions with your wants. =(

But, in my opinion, time and time again, you've talked about how lonely and isolated you feel.

When you talk about not talking to people, it does not sound like it comes from a place of want or comfort or happiness. It's things like "avoiding hurt" and "making it easier" and hyperfocusing on unavailable women as the only(TM) one for you (which, if they're unavailable, then they're not a good match for you!). That sounds rather codependent and unhealthy. I'm torn between describing these behaviors as anxious attachment or fearful avoidant because both seems pretty close to you. I think recognizing patterns in ourselves is one way we can address our behaviors - and what's making us unhappy.

Whether you date or not, though, you are still a person. You've still got an orientation. And it's very much impacting how you navigate the world now. </3

hi you guys! thanks for all that. i kinda don’t know what to say to either of you. i know that i have anxiety and issues with all this. i feel like ace is broken and i know it’s not but it feels like it sometimes. i know i’m self destructive. i know i can’t have her, i know it’s bad to keep holding onto her. i know all of this and it really sucks. i have notes posted all over my room of nice things and they don’t work. nothing works. i rely on people to fill me up and that’s so stupid because i’m the only person i have. i’ve been getting a lot better with that, i’m able to spend time alone and do things alone for the first time in my life now.

i don’t think a partner who respects me exists. i don’t respect me so who would. i’ve been open about this to people and then they say that they respect me and won’t push me and then they continue to ask questions about if i masturbate and how i do it and if i like kissing and if i’ve ever kissed, how i like to be touched. that’s them saying they respect me ha ha. to be completely honest i’ve gotten to the point of utter disgust in myself masturbating. every time i do it i just freak out after and i feel so dirty and disgusting.

i wish i was a cis female who could just go around and be pretty and hook up with whoever i wanted. but i’m not cis, i don’t like men and i don’t wanna really have sex. there’s a reason why i’ve never before and i’m not sure why i never have before fully. i really want to be comfortable with someone to even have a relationship where we do something as simple as holding hands or making out sometimes. i’m honestly a mess with all of this. i don’t want to be an experiment to someone, i’m not some weirdo who you can question to see how the other half lives. i’m a human being and i have feelings and i wish people could actually see that. i feel incredibly broken and no amount of words or comfort will change the way i feel. so i just stopped trying with myself and everything else.

and ultimately, i’m afraid to fall in love or date or talk to people because it’ll give me new feelings and hopes and it’ll be a reason to keep fighting my mental illness and then it’ll end and i’ll come crashing down and be right where i am now. why would i want that.

I get that, it's terrifying. When you have so many people that have let you down or have gotten your hopes up just for them to hurt you, or you don't have friends that treat you all that great, it makes sense you'd be scared of it. Honestly, a lot of what your describing you're doing to help cope with those feelings of being broken or not respecting yourself, or feeling weird is a lot of self destructive behaviour and isolation, both of which I've on;y known to make these types of things worse.

It's really hard when you feel broken, and I see a lot of myself in what you're saying, I can say all I want that I don't want to date because I don't have time, but the truth is, after my ex boyfriend, I'm scared to. I'm scared to trust myself and I'm scared to let another guy in for that fear he may hurt me. It took a while to start letting people in and it's not easy. With the hell going down in my life, every word matters to me, every word I speak shows that I am pushing myself. It's hard but self care really makes a difference, getting up every morning and saying that I am going to do the best I can, letting myself feel love between my family, my friends that helps so much. I know you've mentioned your relationship with your mom might be a little strained, but I'm really wondering if maybe there's anyone you really trust in your life to talk to about this, as well as bringing this up in therapy. I wonder if you'd be up for trying the things I mentioned, one thing a day or maybe a week that scares you, maybe pushing yourself to go say hi to someone. My greatest friendships came from me going up to someone and talking to them, saying "Hey, I'm ___"

Actually, that's how I met my two best friends was because at the train station I was feeling pretty bored and so I dragged my brother to help me out and actually my brother and one of them dated, and the two strangers we walked up to that go to the same school are now the people that show me what strength means. I'm so glad I pushed through the fear of "What if they're mean". Sometimes it really takes that push but it can be hard, especially with anxiety, that's not fun.

And I get that wish to just be "normal", to be cis (I'm trans ftm) and not be ace (I'm not sure how else to put that), but I really want to let you know, there is nothing wrong with you, at all. Just like you said, you're a human with human feelings. I also want to say, I'm sure there is someone out there for you, who will respect you.

Also, those questions are quite personal and disrespectful, also.. weird to ask someone just because you find out their ace. It makes sense you'd feel pretty gross about it. I wonder if you'd be able to let them know google exists? I do that sometimes now when I'm asked strange and out there questions, because what I've found is they are just typically trying to make a joke out of it, they aren't trying to understand more. You don't have to answer all their questions, it's not your responsibility and although you can choose to, seriously, google works for everybody.


I really want to end this with asking what things you do that make you feel empowered? For me, it's soccer, it keeps me healthy and when I make a top corner save no one thought any goalie could get, I feel like I am on top of the world. Is there something that does that for you? Maybe if sports are your thing (after COVID-19 gets better) trying out for an adult team in a sport of your choice, maybe doing a little volunteering, getting into maybe a book club or something. I really hope you can learn to love yourself, because you deserve to feel loved, it's important.

why am i 7 years older then you and you’re wiser than me hahahah. thank you for all that. trust is super hard always. and writing makes me feel empowered! i have a blog that has more readers then i ever imagined in my wildest dreams! there’s like 110 people who have read them all but i never expected that but i haven’t written since december because mental illness loves to take away my joy and gives me writers block

Haha, there's my own life situations where I'm just as confused and stuck, don't worry. I totally get how writing can be really hard when mental health/illness gets in the way, it's something I've been struggling with for a little while. My therapist and counsellor both recommended that I start by just scribbling down a whole bunch of words that come to mind, and depending what I want to write, it can be great - especially if it's emotions because poetry I find really helps me there It's awesome to hear about your blog, that's pretty cool, but it does make sense that it's hard. I wonder, would maybe setting down a time to write each day help you, for me I thought it would feel like an obligation, but actually it started turning into something I looked forward to. I like doing research was a big one that helped me get back into everything, doing research and deciding to write a little report on my findings might sound boring, but it's led into me being able to freely write again, granted I don't know what you enjoy writing about.

With trusting, honestly it's going to be hard especially with the BS you've been dealing with. It does take that conscious effort to let your guard down, but after a while it gets a little more natural. Just don't give up on yourself, alright? I know that might sound pretty weird but seriously, remind yourself no matter what, you're enough.

i love the scribbling word thing! they told me that too and it’s seriously helped me so much. thank you very much


hey, horriblegoose! i gots a question. so today i had to get shoes and i ended up getting them for like 40% off and i was like oh my gosh i feel more with this than i’ve ever felt kissing or touching people or people touching me (not more than holding hands tho! i love holding hands it’s my favorite thing idk why). is that weird? normal for somewhere on the ace spectrum?? also why do i feel like an animal for sex sometimes but the thought of me doing it still makes me freak out. why can’t i just be normal!?!

So It's been a little bit, and a) I'm not 100% sure what's going on for horriblegoose based off xir account info, gotta be honest, I'm a little worried but sadly, there's nothing I can really do except hope xe is okay.

but b) I ended up doing a bit of research and I've noticed some pieces around this in other threads of yours, I just wanted to say, sometimes it's better just to allow yourself to feel the way you do. If treating yourself makes you feel good, great! If holding hands feels better than other things, also great, there's no real "normal" when it comes to this sort of thing. Humans are weird as it goes, so trying to fit into what seems like the normal, really isn't great. Definitions like asexuality have a lot of variety and a lot of people have different experiences. If the thing you mentioned makes you feel good, that's alright, honestly, fantasies can be weird or seem weird, there's a lot out there and my mom and I have a running joke about granny porn so like, there's that. I assure you, there's weirder stuff out there, in my opinion anyways. Either way, it's still a really good idea to just let yourself be you, do what you find interesting and fun (keeping in mind social distancing, please). I learned so much more about myself the second I stopped feeling like I needed a label for myself, I've always been told I was gay, and yeah, I think that fits now, but I wasn't sure at first, and stressing about it didn't help. Sexuality can be fluid and if any of that changes, it's not really a "bad" thing.

Jumping in to second (third?) the "there is no 'normal'" sentiment! Or, alternatively, EVERYONE is normal.

Dominant cultural messaging (what we see in media, what we hear from others, etc) wants us to believe that there's a kind of "normal" sexuality, but it's a big lie. Human sexuality is SO diverse, in ways that we never account for. It's one giant spectrum. Where ever you are on that sexuality spectrum is fine and healthy, and like 0PT1M15T1C said, the best thing we can do for ourselves is to accept and love ourselves. <3

sky wrote:hey, horriblegoose! i gots a question. so today i had to get shoes and i ended up getting them for like 40% off and i was like oh my gosh i feel more with this than i’ve ever felt kissing or touching people or people touching me (not more than holding hands tho! i love holding hands it’s my favorite thing idk why). is that weird? normal for somewhere on the ace spectrum?? also why do i feel like an animal for sex sometimes but the thought of me doing it still makes me freak out. why can’t i just be normal!?!

Hi, sky. New account/new name - this is horriblegoose, though. I'm really sorry. I know I left you hanging, and I've been feeling bad about that, so I just had to come back around and finally address this now that I feel able to.

There's a reason cake is considered a symbol of the ace community. Ever heard the sayings "I'd rather have cake" or "cake is better than sex"? These kind of jokingly became mottoes of some (sex averse/sex indifferent) asexuals years ago, and today we still use cake as a symbol to represent asexuality and in a lot of ace pride art and ace jokes.

Of course you can enjoy and be passionate about things other than sex! Of course you can enjoy and be passionate about things more than sex! It makes a lot of sense that you bought these shoes and realized "oh, this is something I actually enjoy! This made me feel happy and feel good about myself."

That's what the cake analogy is all about. Finding satisfaction in things that really satisfy you, like doing something for yourself by getting yourself shoes you like.

This has been big in the ace community because, though there are sex favorable aces, sex is a lot different when you don't have sexual attraction (even when you do still have libido/sex drive). It's about seeking out what you really desire and finding happiness that way.

And it's totally awesome to enjoy handholding! We all have things we enjoy and things we don't. There are aces who like cuddling, aces who like kissing, aces who like handholding, aces who only enjoy these if they're platonic, aces who only enjoy these if they're romantic, aces who enjoy some of those, and aces who enjoy none of those. I've always been rather touch averse and sex repulsed (and romance indifferent), but for some reason, I really like making out. You don't have to have some underlying reason or explanation for why you like the things you like. You're allowed to just like them! You're allowed to really like shoes but not really kissing but also like handholding. What's more important than what you do or don't like is giving yourself the freedom and the room to express and create boundaries about what you do and don't like.

Finally, your struggle with wanting sex/sexual intimacy but being freaked out about the realism of it actually occurring could be due to many things. From some of the things you've said, I highly suspect a large part of your struggle is due to coercive heteronormativity and internalized anti-asexuality. Society is constantly sending us the message that we all have to monogamously pair up in cis man x cis woman couples and commit to each other romantically and sexually and enjoy sex and romance (but never talk about it - especially the sex part, because it's shameful to be open about it! that should be private!) and have children and make a family in this way. If you have feelings that go against any one of these ideas (being polyam, being ethically nonmonogamous, be queer, not be in a cis man x cis woman relationship, not enjoying romance, not enjoying sex, proudly enjoying sex, not wanting children, wanting to adopt, even having infertility problems, etc.) then you are shamed for that and it's treated as not normal. It's incredibly hard to come to terms with who you are and how you feel when you're made to be ashamed of it any time you speak about it. It's incredibly hard to come to terms with who you are when you've been constantly told from birth that it's wrong to be that way. Even if no one out right says anything to you, then you still have to deal with having taken in and internalized these messages and feeling as though you are doing something inherently wrong just by existing.

However, another part of your struggle could also just be that you have a sex drive and/or you enjoy the thought of sex in theory but genuinely aren't interested in it in reality. The disconnect between these two things can be really hard to come to terms with the fact that this is okay to feel! Think of it this way... I think it would be cool to be an astronaut and get to go to space. However, I have no actual desire or motivation to make these dreams a reality. I think the training would be too much for me, I don't know that I could really deal with the impacts of space and being both isolated and yet never really alone, and I think trying to follow these dreams could limit me from other, bigger dreams I have. But I'm still gonna dream sometimes and think about what it would be like to go into space. I don't need to beat myself up for thinking it would be cool all while knowing I'm never going to seriously pursue it. I can just feel my feelings and accept that they are what they are.

I think the most important thing you can do regarding this is work on just accepting that you're allowed to feel your feelings. They may not always make the most sense, but you're still allowed to feel them. You don't need to beat yourself up for having feelings, even conflicting feelings. You don't need to call yourself names and put yourself down for having feelings, even conflicting feelings.

You are normal. Even non-aces have different levels of libido and different relationships to sex and sexual activities. Even non-aces get freaked out by sex. Even non-aces get horny but don't want to actually have sex every time they get horny. Even non-aces can desperately want sex and yet get freaked out if an actual opportunity to have it comes up.

You are normal. The difference between you and some(!) others is that you're beating yourself up for how you're feeling instead of just letting yourself feel the feelings and ride them out.

I hope you've been well and are taking care of yourself. <3

Just as a head's up - I will try to come back again if you ask me specifically another question, but I don't plan on resuming my regular activity here. ^^

You may be interested in AVEN (asexuality.org) as a resource for more information and a larger community on asexuality, though! I also suggest swankivy's YouTube channel. She actually wrote a book "The Invisible Orientation" that's an asexuality 101 introduction. I don't know if her book would actually be helpful to you (I haven't read it), but when I was first coming to terms with my asexuality, I really liked swankivy's videos detailing her experiences and taking down common anti-asexual myths and beliefs. They were really helpful to me to process my own feelings and know that the things people said that hurt me were okay to find hurtful - and why I found them hurtful.